Page 1 of 1
Quercetin and Modified Kneel-Sit Chair
Posted: Tue Aug 05, 2003 4:34 pm
Quercetin, skilled relaxation, warm baths, and hyper-vigilance with avoiding anything that aggravates the symptoms. For me that is sitting on any soft cushions brings on flare ups.
I bought one of those knee chairs, but I don't feel it is designed well. Too much of bend in the tube supporting going to the seat. You can actually site in it and lift your knees off the knee pad. (ie. 100% of you weight on your butt.) I cut out the bend and replaced it with some sheet steel. Here is what it looks like now.
I alternate between standing, the knee chair, and sitting on a firm surface to get through the work day. The new configuration of the knee chair is tough on your knees, but totally keeps my perineum area 100% free from pressure. Has made a big difference. BTW, you can get those knee chairs much cheaper through ebay.
I had tried Prosta-Q and it seemed to help, but a few weeks ago, I picked up some Quercitin pills at the local health food store and WOW, what a nice difference. I am seeing improvement every day. Keeping my fingers crossed that things keep improving.
Re: Similar success using Quercitin and skilled relaxation.
Posted: Tue Aug 05, 2003 4:48 pm
Please give detailed instructions on how you modified the chair. I think you are on to something there.
infojunkie wrote:I had tried Prosta-Q and it seemed to help, but a few weeks ago, I picked up some Quercitin pills at the local health food store and WOW, what a nice difference. I am seeing improvement every day. Keeping my fingers crossed that things keep improving.
Prosta-Q is more effective than plain quercetin. There is a study that shows a much higher efficacy for Prosta-Q. You may have felt the cumulative effect of Prosta-Q about the same time you started taking plain quercetin.
Posted: Tue Aug 05, 2003 5:45 pm
What was the make of the pills?? Just interested thats all.
Posted: Tue Aug 05, 2003 7:30 pm
The brand I picked up is Source Naturals Activated Quercitin. The only reason I chose it was that is was more expensive than the other two on the shelf. (Henry's Marketplace) It was $15 for 50 tabs, the other two were $11 for 90 tabs. (I believe you get what you pay for , so I tend to spend the extra money hoping to get better quality.)
Here is what is looks like:
Source Naturals Activated Quercetin
webslave, I'll post more detailed info on the chair mods this evening.
Posted: Tue Aug 05, 2003 8:29 pm
To those tempted to use cheaper, generic quercetin brands, I say go ahead, but be aware of what Dr Shoskes said:
The quercetin in Prosta-Q from Farr Labs is combined with other agents that enhance the intestinal absorption of quercetin (bromelain and papain) as well as other antioxidants, zinc and Saw Palmetto. It was important to do our intial placebo controlled randomized trial with pure quercetin for the proof of principle, but having shown that there is a beneficial effect, I felt free to recommend to Farr labs the other ingredients to hopefully maximize the benefit to the patient. We have found many patients so far who had a partial response to generic quercetin who had a complete response from Prosta-Q. Some patients who were taking double or triple the dose of generic quercetin are now fine on a single Prosta-Q. Additionally, the response time for patients seems to be faster, with more patients noticing an effect after a few days rather than many weeks. I have to believe this is from the enhanced absorption rather than the addition of zinc and saw palmetto because these latter 2 agents can take months to produce an effect individually.
Having seen many patients fail or do worse on generic quercetin and then improve dramatically on Prosta-Q, I have no doubt that something in it; whether the purity of the ingredients, the increased absorption or some other interaction between the ingredients at the speicific ratios used, brings an added benefit to men with nonbacterial prostatitis.
What I have learned from using quercetin in many patients with different symptoms and forms of chronic prostatitis/chronic pelvic pain syndrome is that the use of pure quercetin, while effective in many patients, is a start, but can be improved upon. I think it is particularly important to address absorption issues, because quercetin has variable absorption when taken alone. We are currently working with a supplement manufacturer to produce a capsule for us which combines a known potent dose of quercetin with agents that can improve quercetin absorption as well as agents that can work synergistically with quercetin to reduce oxidant stress in the prostate
In our original experience with generic quercetin, the first effect was seen in under 6 weeks and the maximal effect by 2 months. Using Prosta-Q, both these times seem to be shortened by at least 2 weeks with many patients noting a positive effect within a few days. Before we had a reliable source, many patients found that 1 brand of store bought quercetin did nothing for them but another worked immediately. Given the lack of FDA regulation, it is unfortunately a crap shoot when buying supplements from a health food store whether they actually contain what the label says. We have had several patients with no response to quercetin but a strong improvement with Prosta-Q.
Prosta-Q is only brand of quercetin that has been clinically studied and proven effective in CPPS. The manufacturer uses pharmaceutical grade quercetin with documented potency. Others have shown that up to 2/3 of herbal supplements sold in this country do not have the promised ingredients . Prosta-Q has a mixture of bromelain and papain that enhance intestinal absorption. Prosta-Q's manufacturer has spent huge sums in public and doctor awareness (advertising, both at AUA and other meetings, reps that visit doctors) on chronic prostatitis and the options for patients without infection and for those whom antibiotics don't help. There is not one other company, either pharmacetuical or neutraceutical that has done this for CPPS patients.
Posted: Tue Aug 05, 2003 11:58 pm
The Management of Farr Labs, who produce Prosta-Q, respond to the Source Naturals product in this way:
This is not even close to our product. First, vit. C is not recommended due to acidity issues for any bladder or prostate condition. Secondly, we feel that a capsule is much better so the person taking the product does not have to ingest binders and exipients and the important ingredients will be more readily absorbed due to the low dissolution time in a natural gelatin cap. Thirdly, we feel that ethically the content of each cap should be shown in the ingredient listing, not show as multiple caps to create an appearance of increased potency and a bogus low price.
Knee chair mods
Posted: Wed Aug 06, 2003 2:50 am
Here is the info on how I modified the knee chair. I used the following items:
- Angle sheet steel (with holes) from Home Depot. The angle steel can be found in the same area as the threaded rod. It is about 7$ for a 3 ft (900mm) piece.
- 4" length - 1/4" bolts. (100mm long, diameter 6mm)
1) Cut out the bend in the tubing with a hacksaw (about a 4"[100mm] section).
2) Cut about 4 even 2 ft (600mm) sections of the angle steel. Match height to fit your needs.
3) Drill holes where necessary to line up frame holes and seat holes with angle steel.
4) Line up and attach two angle steel pieces together (opposed) to each tube.
5) Bolt together on the upper seat pad.
Warning, the chair can be tough on your knees. Modify and use at your own risk.
Posted: Wed Aug 06, 2003 3:01 am
Sorry, I didn't mean to infer that off the shelf quercitin is superior to Prosta-Q. It's obvious that Prosta-Q is a high quality product and is probably the best thing available. I was just relaying my experience.
As we are all aware there are lots of variables with this condition. More information is probably better than less. No?
Posted: Wed Aug 06, 2003 3:16 am
Of course, more info is always better. You raised an interesting and recurring point that has not, until now, been properly addressed. :happy:
Thanks for the instructions on modification. Can you post more photos please?