Breakthrough for me!

Tell us about how you are beating this
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webslave
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Breakthrough for me!

Post by webslave » Sat Mar 08, 2003 4:23 pm

As you know if you have followed my posts on the topic, I have been experimenting with antihistamines to control my stomach and bowel pains connected with my diet and, in some strange way, with my CPPS too. I fall into that category of CPPS patient who has lots of allergies, a touch of what looks like Fibromyalgia or Chronic Fatigue Syndrome (CFS), problems with many foods and strange symptoms all over the body (rashes, aches in joints etc). My CPPS started at about the same time I started waking in the wee hours of the morning with griping, grinding stomach pain. I started off using Maalox to quell this pain, but that didn't help at all really.

To cut a long story short, I eventually got control of my CPPS and went into remission by: using Quercetin, avoiding wheat and a few other key foods, not sitting all day, avoiding stress, and taking nutritional supplements. (The rest of my protocol is at this page: http://www.chronicprostatitis.com/protocol.html )

Anyway, fast forward to the present: although my CPPS is no longer a big issue (occasional twinges, mostly after dietary indiscretion, or too much sitting), I still had a tremendous problem with my diet. The list of foods I could not eat without repercussions had grown to encompass almost all foods. I was left eating a small range of items (mostly chicken and a few vegetables - hospital food!).

Bananas, potato and onions, to give an example of the effects I faced, would cause such severe colon bloating and pain that I could not sleep. Nuts caused throbbing headaches. Wheat caused total exhaustion and depression (as well as being the numero uno CPPS trigger). Corn caused a rash to appear on my face. Cranberries and Raspberries caused terrible stomach pain that would wake me from sleep, and also burn my bladder/prostate area. I could go on like this for several paragraphs, but I'm sure you get the idea. The symptoms appeared all over my body. I commented to my wife that it was as if life itself had turned against me, that I was being "pushed off" the planet, and I felt I was holding on by my nails, like a man holding on to the edge of a cliff. I often felt pretty desperate, let me tell you. :crying:

I could not shake the feeling that somehow the CPPS and my allergies and food intolerances were connected. But how? :confused:

All during the early, terrible years of CPPS in the early 1990s, the only one time I'd had relief was when I took a drug that was a mixture of cortisone and an antihistamine. I had just a few tablets of this substance, but it gave me wonderful relief. For some reason I could not get more of this drug combo. A few years later, trying to replicate this relief, I took just plain cortisone (prednisolone), but to no avail. Maybe it was the antihistamine that helped and not the cortisone?, I reasoned. So I took the latest antihistamine (I forget the name), one that was supposed not to make you drowsy. No luck. :mad2:

Fast forward to the present. I read about how people like Jill Osborne of the ICN had experienced a lot of success with hydroxyzine, and old-fashioned H1-receptor antagonist, first generation "hit you on the head" type antihistamine. It is supposed to work on nerves as well as histamine, and also alleviates anxiety. Not bad, I thought, I'll give it a whirl. It may help my food problems.

And, by the whiskers of Kurvi Tasch, it did! :laugh:

I have now experimented by eating almost all of my "forbidden" foods and had only mild or no reactions. I hasten to add that I am only taking 25mg of Vistaril (hydroxyzine) a day, about 25% of an adult dose. This is a miracle to me, my friends -- I cannot tell you how much this means to me. It's like a door has been opened to life again. :jester:

On the negative side, the hydroxyzine, taken at night, caused me to wake the third day with a sharp, urgent pain in my bladder prostate area! :pissed:

Oh cursed fate! Just my luck, I thought. Finally I find something to release me from the pains of food allergy and intolerance, and it causes my CPPS to flare! How can this be? I did some fast thinking and came up with my "Allergy Theory of CPPS"©: viewtopic.php?t=385

I believe this effect of the old class of antihistamines has caused most men with CPPS to avoid its use. I believe they all have this effect on us.

Thinking laterally :icon3: , I reasoned that the way to counteract the antihistamine was to use a smooth muscle relaxant like Hytrin. Seems logical, and my urologist friends did not object. Hytrin has a number of good things going for it: viewtopic.php?t=237

It worked. :thumbs_up:

So that's where I am today. Yesterday I ate a whole lot of stuff that would have had me moaning with pain today, but I'm fine! I awoke this morning with very mild tightness in the bladder area from the antihistamine, but since I'm only taking 1mg of Hytrin at night I expect to be able to eliminate that too eventually as I increase the Hytrin dose.

I do not know if other antihistamines will work as effectively for me. I've learned that people can react differently to different things in unpredictable ways, for instance: although many men are helped hugely by quercetin, some aren't at all. So I cannot say if this regimen will help you, or whether any other antihistamines will help me. I already know that Claritin / Clarinex did nothing for my food problems, and nor did Seldane (Terfenadine) and some other antihistamines. So this area is a bit of a mystery -- probably some complex, genetically mediated chemistry at play here. :pensativo:

I am hoping, perhaps optimistically, that the blocking of all the histamine from my system may eventually lead to the cure of my CPPS. If it does, it means a large number of men may be able to access a total cure for the condition, using simple drugs.

If I fail to eradicate my CPPS completely, it still means I have discovered a novel way (antihistamines balanced with alpha blockers) of alleviating some of the pain, fatigue and distress that so often accompanies CPPS.

Õlé!
Last edited by webslave on Sun Mar 16, 2003 8:51 pm, edited 5 times in total.

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Post by Hepcat » Sat Mar 08, 2003 11:08 pm

So, Mark.

Do you think that for those of us not responding well to Quercetin. neurontin, Elavil, ect and have as primary pains those like testicular and abdominal that hydroxyzine would be a good first step, eventually moving into a hydroxyzine\hytrin combo if complications arise?

I'm getting progresive myalgias all over my body. I'd like to think it's a low grade response to inflammation and that an anti-histamine could be an answer. :cry:
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Post by webslave » Sat Mar 08, 2003 11:43 pm

I think if anything I have said about my history sounds familiar to you, it cannot hurt to try hydroxyzine and then stave off the prostate reaction with Hytrin. All this with your doctor's agreement please - no playing Web MD and buying drugs without scripts on the internet!

Be careful with suddenly discontinuing things like Neurontin and Elavil. Look into it! You can happily continue any phytotherapy (Algonot, Prosta-Q).

It is a harmless thing to do. BTW, you are not supposed to drive a car for the first 24 hrs after your first Hytrin dose, and also when titrating upwards.

Note: I found out recently that opioids can trigger mast cells, so keep it in mind if you're taking Vicodin.

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That's Great!

Post by ddarcher » Sat Mar 08, 2003 11:56 pm

That's great Mark! Please keep us posted as time goes on. The more success stories the better!
This communication provides general information, and is not a substitute for face-to-face medical care. Therefore a doctor-patient relationship should not be assumed by the reader.
Good luck,
Dale (Psychiatrist)

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Post by Hepcat » Sun Mar 09, 2003 12:43 am

Thanks Mark :)

I have a very agreeable GP who is letting me manage my own pharmacotherapy under his supervision. That, plus having my own copy of the CPS has held me in good stead.
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gunde

Post by gunde » Sun Mar 09, 2003 4:08 pm

Mark:
If I were you I would keep off the forbidden foods and still use Vistaril, atleast for some time. But then again feeling happy also has an impact on ones health.

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Post by webslave » Sun Mar 09, 2003 5:25 pm

You talk a heap of good sense. I binged on Pepsi for a few days and the sheer acidity of it hurt me. Either the Pepsi or somehting else ... very acid stomach suddenly. I need to keep a level head.

On the other hand, this stratagem really is working! I am going to make a page about it.
Last edited by webslave on Thu Mar 13, 2003 6:49 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Post by webslave » Sun Mar 09, 2003 8:29 pm

Unfortunate new development - heartburn. :pissed: :yelling:

So far everything has been going wonderfully well, eating everything I like with the help of the hydroxyzine and no prostate pain at all thanks to the Hytrin! But (there's always a but) I now have severe heartburn that doesn't respond to antacids. My mother has a hiatus hernia and she had this problem too. I did a bit of research and it seems that alpha blocker medications can cause relaxation of the lower esophageal sphincter (muscle) and thus cause heart burn. Sigh!

Question: if I switch from Hytrin to a prostate-specific a-blocker like Xatral or Flomax, will this stop the lower esophageal sphincter relaxing?

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Post by webslave » Mon Mar 10, 2003 4:41 pm

I have ordered Flomax. Stopped taking Hytrin.

Just a side comment: my urine stream is thick, heavy and effortless, like a boy's, when I take this alpha blocker stuff. I realize I have had a constricted stream for well over a decade, even though I am only 44.

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Post by J Dimitrakov » Mon Mar 10, 2003 10:06 pm

webmaster wrote: Question: if I switch from Hytrin to a prostate-specific a-blocker like Xatral or Flomax, will this stop the lower esophageal sphincter relaxing?
Most of the data we have is based on experimental findings. Theoretically, Flomax is about 40 times more selective for the prostatic alpha-1A-adrenoreceptors, so the chance of getting lower esophageal sphincter relaxation should be lower.
This communication provides general information, and is not a substitute for face-to-face medical care. A doctor-patient relationship should not be assumed by the reader.
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Post by webslave » Mon Mar 10, 2003 10:37 pm

Thanks for that data! I have asked my MD for Flomax and I look forward to using it. I hope the Flomax also relaxes the bladder smooth muscle, just in case the Vistaril discomfort was coming from there in whole or in part.

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Post by webslave » Tue Mar 11, 2003 2:31 pm

Started Flomax, works like a charm! Just a bit of nasal stuffiness. Here's a tip: Ralph has advised me to take it during the day and not at night if I get a recurrence of reflux and heartburn, because lying down may be a factor. Thanks, Ralph.

Now on 2x 25mg hydroxyzine a day with minimal to no prostate reaction.

I continue to enjoy food I usually cannot, just cannot eat. I am also feeling more bright and normal than I have felt in years and my energy levels are waaay up!

I believe it takes a while for the full effects of the antihistamine to be seen (e.g. Jill Osborne says the drug took a long time to slowly work its spell, or <probably> it look a long time for histamine-affected organs to recover), and so I'm looking forward to how I'll feel and how my prostate feels in a few months.

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Post by Richard.N » Tue Mar 11, 2003 3:11 pm

Started Flomax, works like a charm!
Mark - have you, er, checked out the 'other' possible side effect yet?
Richard

Age: 39. | Onset Age: 30. Onset Date: January 2002. Symptoms (back then): Supra-pubic pain, back pain, urinary frequency, urgency and difficulty, weak stream, nocturia, (and variously) chronic fatigue, IBS. Current symptoms: more frequent than normal, but pretty much under control. Current amelioration: Xatral 10mg, Mirtazapine 30mg. | Worsened By: Stress, binge drinking, strained bowel movements, bloating, sitting on hard surfaces, jogging, and regularly - THE WINTER!

I'm not a medical expert. My comment is opinion. See your medical professional.

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Post by webslave » Tue Mar 11, 2003 5:18 pm

Hold on just a sec :eek:

..... hmmm,, sort of half inside, half outside, if you get my drift .. :(

You know, they claim only 8% of men get this effect on 0.4mg and 18% at 0.8mg, but I doubt it. You often can't trust what drug companies tell you. :mad:

Comparing Xatral to Flomax: "About 7% of the patients using tamsulosin (Flomax) experienced retrograde ejaculation in one study which did not occur in the alfuzosin (Xatral) studies."

Xatral not available in USA, as far as I know (not in PDR).

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Post by Richard.N » Tue Mar 11, 2003 6:05 pm

sort of half inside, half outside, if you get my drift
Yes. Exactly. And not quite as satisfying I find. I do also worry that the material that finds itself in the bladder causes further irritation to both bladder and prostate on it's way out.

They should have called it FloBack :wink:
About 7% of the patients using tamsulosin (Flomax) experienced retrograde ejaculation in one study which did not occur in the alfuzosin (Xatral) studies."
So, if 7% actually equals 90% what does 0% really mean?
Xatral not available in USA, as far as I know (not in PDR)
"Xatral®, released on the European market in 1988 in its 2.5 mg formulation, is marketed today in various formulations in Europe, Latin America, Africa, Asia, and the Middle East. Xatral ® OD was released on the European market in 2000 and is in process of registration in the United States and the rest of the world."

http://en.sanofi-synthelabo.com

Looks like Xatral is the new Exocet... :smile:

I think I'll get some.
Richard

Age: 39. | Onset Age: 30. Onset Date: January 2002. Symptoms (back then): Supra-pubic pain, back pain, urinary frequency, urgency and difficulty, weak stream, nocturia, (and variously) chronic fatigue, IBS. Current symptoms: more frequent than normal, but pretty much under control. Current amelioration: Xatral 10mg, Mirtazapine 30mg. | Worsened By: Stress, binge drinking, strained bowel movements, bloating, sitting on hard surfaces, jogging, and regularly - THE WINTER!

I'm not a medical expert. My comment is opinion. See your medical professional.

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